not starting

1998 DODGE DAKOTA
270,000 MILES • V8 • 4WD • AUTOMATIC
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SILVERBULLET91
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Just bought this truck recently and have found in the morning after sitting overnight or for a day it occasionally won't start. This doesn't happen every time it sits and doesn't seem to be related to temperature or moisture. What is constant is that if it starts first thing it runs great all day.

The starter and battery work great because they crank the engine over quickly but it doesn't cough, sputter or anything when it won't start, just cranks and cranks. This problem occured before I changed the air filter, spark plugs, wires, cap and rotor and still occurs with equal frequency after the tuneup. On one occasion I pulled a spark plug and grounded the electrode with the wire hooked to the plug and there was a strong, bright spark every second or so of cranking so it appears the ignition systems works as it should. The fuel pump primes when the key is turned to ON so the relays that power the ignition and fuel pump seem to be doing their job.

I replaced the fuel pump (which is a combination pump, filter, pressure regulator, check valve) and it started and ran fine the day I changed it but this morning it would not start again.

I got my hands on a fuel pressure tester and found that when the ignition key was turned on after depressurizing the system it went to 46psi (book says 44-54psi is "normal") and when I finally got the truck started it ran steady at 50psi at idle. After I turned the truck off it went down to 46psi. I waited 5 minutes and it was at 44psi. Now, almost an hour later its at 40psi. (the Haynes manual says you have a leak somewhere if the pressure drops below 30psi in 5 minutes, but my pressure is holding much longer than that, although I don't know how well a "normal" system holds pressure.)

I plugged the block heater in this morning (it was about 40F, 10C, not cold) and the truck eventually did start (sometimes it starts later in the day at random, not sure if the block heater does anything or not). At that point my Scanguage told me the coolant temp was 96F. None of the fuel lines, rail, injectors leak externally that I can see by visual inspection (though I'm no expert there) and I'm at a loss as to what else the problem could be.
Oct 25, 2010 at 12:18 PM
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RASMATAZ
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Hi silverbullet91, Welcome to 2carpros

Do below immediately to determine if its fuel or spark problem don't wait for nothing and get back with some testing results. Something has to give-let me know

This guide should help

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/car-cranks-but-wont-start

Get a helper disconnect a sparkplug wire or 2 and ground it to the engine at least 3/16 away from ground -have helper crank engine over-do you have a snapping blue spark? If so-you have a fuel related problem, check the fuel pressure to rule out the fuel filter/fuel pump/pressure regulator and listen to the injector/s are they pulsing or hook up a noid light. No snapping blue spark continue to troubleshoot the ignition system-power input to the coil/COP/coil packs,coil's resistances,distributor pick-up coil, ignition control module, cam and crank sensors and computer Note: If it doesn't apply disregard it.
Oct 25, 2010 at 1:11 PM
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SILVERBULLET91
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Thanks for the quick reply! On the ignition side, I don't have a helper handy to help test the spark, but I may be able to do that later. Just to clarify, its the plug boot I want to hold 3/16" from a ground and watch if a spark jumps from the metal part inside down to ground? There's quite a recess in the rubber before the metal part starts.

I believe I've eliminated the fuel pump, filter and pressure regulator as culprits since I replaced the whole assembly and still have the same problem as before. On the fuel side that leaves me with clogged or leaking line, or leaky rail or injectors (that I can think of) does that rate of pressure loss indicated by my pressure tester sound normal?
Oct 25, 2010 at 1:51 PM
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RASMATAZ
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Your fuel pressure sounds good to me-lets check for spark-remove the sparkplug and hook it back to the wire and ground it-let me know later when help is on hand
Oct 25, 2010 at 1:59 PM
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SILVERBULLET91
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Hi, sorry for the delay...have been busy with work and haven't been able to look at the truck.

There is spark at the plug while cranking, I tested the ignition coil with the Haynes manual and the secondary resistance is within limits....the primary resistance though is 1.4ohms but it should only be 0.96 - 1.2ohms (although my meter gives me 0.4ohms of resistance when I simply touch the testing tips together). Does it sound like that ignition coil is bad or is the high reading simply the fault of the meter?

I also disconnected the cam position sensor wiring harness (CPS is under the distributor cap on my truck, may also be called a distributor pick-up coil) and it does get a 5v signal as it should when the key is turned to ON. To further test the cam or crank sensors the book indicates I need an analog multimeter but I only have a digital one handy. If it sounds like the coil is or may be ok, I can go get an analog MM and test the cam and crank sensors.

The truck does get an RPM readout when cranking (140rpm), I assume it gets this information from either the cam or crank sensor so hopefully that information proves at least one of them is OK!
Nov 3, 2010 at 3:44 PM
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RASMATAZ
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If you're getting spark the cam and crank sensors are okay -check if you're getting fuel
Nov 3, 2010 at 3:52 PM
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SILVERBULLET91
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With the plug out you can smell fuel after its been cranking. I checked the fuel pressure and, after being depressurized, the pressure goes right up to 46psi when the key is turned ON and after a downward spike stays at 50psi throughout cranking it.

The only thing I'm unsure about is the strength of the spark. It's white, not blue but is visible in daylight and sparks every second or so while cranking.
Nov 3, 2010 at 4:24 PM
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RASMATAZ
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Zero the meter and retest the coil if its coming up with the same reading substitute or replace the coil-but before you do that verify the valve and ignition timing
Nov 3, 2010 at 4:42 PM
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SILVERBULLET91
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The book says the ignition timing is not adjustable on my truck (computer controlled here, my old car would allow me to rotate the distributor to change the timing). How does one check the valve timing? This problem is intermittent in nature, so if the valves are off for whatever reason it should never run, right?
Nov 3, 2010 at 4:56 PM
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RASMATAZ
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It doesn't matter if its computer controlled its only the ignition timing is being controlled when to fire the coil by using the CPS input signal-if the valve timing is off -meaning the camshaft and crankshaft alignment you can get fuel and spark all day it won't fire up

Then again like you said its an intermittent problem that takes it out of the picture-test the ASD relay if okay-replace the coil
Nov 3, 2010 at 5:09 PM
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SILVERBULLET91
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Fair enough! To test the ASD, I checked for 12v going to the ignition coil with the key on (yes, for a second) and also when the truck was cranking. It also got 12v while cranking which I think means the ASD is working fine. However, it's getting dark here now and when I got my girlfriend to crank it over I could see a spark jumping around the outside of the ignition coil, just about where the base of the distributor wire's terminal is. I guess it wasn't dark enough for me to see that before...new ignition coil ordered, lol.

Thanks for all the help! I will let you know how it turns out!
Nov 3, 2010 at 5:37 PM
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RASMATAZ
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I'll be waiting-Good Luck
Nov 3, 2010 at 6:07 PM
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GEO83
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My truck will not start it only cranks. It used to start when it wanted to but now it won't start at all. The battery, the starter motor and the fuel pump are new. I really am not sure what it could be. The ODB reader gives the code P0720 but not sure if it is a computer or electrical problem.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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That code deals with the output speed sensor on the transmission. That shouldn't prevent it from starting.

Tell me this, will the engine start if you use starting fluid? Is the fuel pump pressure within the manufacturer's specs? Have you checked to make sure there is a good hot blue spark to the plugs?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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GEO83
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I got it started earlier today when I replaced the fuel pump relay. But after another attempt at starting it won't even crank. It sounded like the starter but that's brand new and when I try to tap it still nothing.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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So the starter is no longer turning the engine to start? Is it making any noise?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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GEO83
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You can hear when there is current being sent. Its not a click though, but nothing happens.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Have a helper turn the key to the start position while you check for voltage to the smaller wire on the starter. You should have 12v. If you do, replace the starter. If you don't, let me know.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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GEO83
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Well I couldn't test the voltage to the smaller wire but I tried cleaning what I believe is the neutral switch on the transmission and after it started three times no problem. But after it went back to nothing.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Have you tried to start it in neutral?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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69BOSS302
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The engine was running fine. I stopped it for a couple of minutes and when i tried to start it again it sounded like it fired off on a couple of cylinders for just a split second and then nothing happened. It turns over just fine, the fuel pump is comming on. I checked the relays in the fuse pannel and the fuses and they are ok. I pulled a plug and grounded it and I do not have a spark.
Do you have any ideas or suggestions?????
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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RASMATAZ
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No snapping blue spark continue to troubleshoot the ignition system-power input to the coil/coil,distributor pick-up coil, ignition control module, cam and crank sensors-
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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GEO83
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Yes I did but there was no change.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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GFLAT65
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1998 Dodge Dakota 6cyl. Battery is charged, but nothing happens when I turn the key. No headlights/radio, etc with key in ON position. No problems, then all of a sudden no reaction when turning key. Bad ignition switch?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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SATURNTECH9
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Have you checked to make sure the battery cable's are clean and tight?Also have you had the battery tested?Do you have a multimeter to do some testing?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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HDTAMMIE
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my 98 dakota sport won't start.. I drove from
DE to Fl with no problems at all. arrived in fl and hasen't started since.. I have no spark to coil I am gonna be honest.. I know nothing about this I've had a couple friends check it out for me and I've spent a few dollars buying the parts and pices they said I needed... well still won't start it cranks but won't run. Please anyone out there with a bit of knowledge about Dodge.. Help me....
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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RASMATAZ
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Have the ASD relay/coil/distributor pick-up,ignition control module and camshaft and crankshaft position sensors checked out.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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KCCOOZ
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Everything was fine , drove home, 2 hours later truck wont start.repalced dist. cap, plugs,wires and coil. any ideas?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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BLACKOP555
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first i will have to verify, is the vehicle attempting to start i.e crank?

or no crank no key repsonse what so ever?

post back and we will solve it
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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KCCOOZ
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yes it attempts to crank
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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KCCOOZ
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I mean to say yes it cranks
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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BLACKOP555
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next bet is to buy a spark tester and check for spark on all cylinders, best way to tell if the vehicle is getting spark and weather you should concentrate on spark or fuel.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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KARIAN
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My truck starts everytime except when its relativily warm outside but raining so basically its damp outside - it won't start if its been sitting for overnight or for several hours and it has the above outside weather. full tuneup has been done
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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JDL
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Hello, if it is temp related, I think about the coolant temp sensor. I'm not saying it is faulty, just making suggestions on what to check.

Are there any codes? Some of the national brand autostores will check codes for free.

When the problem occurs, if it cranks good but won't start, find out what your missing, fuel--spark?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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KARIAN
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The only problem with flashing a code if it won't start I can't get it to an auto store - will check the other stuff you mentioned.
thanks
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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RBJAEGER
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Truck wont start. Has electricity as far as lights etc.. When I left work started with a jump. When I insert key it clicks but does not start. Is the problem the alternator or the starter. If I change the alternator in the morning should it start?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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RASMATAZ
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Lets get the battery and alternator load tested who knows could be a bad connection at the battery check it
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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KUZROCKS
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my truck died wile driving.It turns or cranks but wont start up,checked all fluids"good" what could it be.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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RASMATAZ
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Do below to determine if its fuel or spark problem

Disconnect a sparkplug wire or 2 and ground it to the engine -have helper crank engine over-do you have a snapping blue spark? If so-you have a fuel related problem, check the fuel pressure to rule out the fuel filter/fuel pump/pressure regulator and listen to the injector/s are they pulsing or hook up a noid light. No snapping blue spark continue to troubleshoot the ignition system-power input to the coil/coil packs,coil's resistances,cap and rotor /distributor pick-up coil, ignition control module, ECM,Ignitor camshaft and crankshaft sensors- Note: If it doesn't apply disregard it
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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ANIXS
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Engine Performance problem
1998 Dodge Dakota V8 Two Wheel Drive Automatic 150k miles

A few weeks back, my truck decided it didnt want to start. So after trying it a few times, it finally caught, and i went on my way. But come more recently, it wont start at all, and ill have to get a jump and keep trying, and so far, it always Eventually catches. But its getting more frequent. And to make things even better, while driving, it will just die, AND my start problem happens. Ive tested and replaced the ignition coil, wires, plugs, rotor/cap. Money is tight and i cant exactly just drop it off somewhere, because when i had it scanned (advanced auto parts) it threw out 2 codes, neither have to do with legitimate starting(throttle PS, and a bad relay [replaced]) so what the real problem isnt showing up.. any ideas?
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)
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ROCKETMAN1
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That throttle position sensor sounds suspecious to me. It can cause problems with ideling misfire etc. If you have a voltage meter you should check it. It should be 0.7 volts DC. The sensor could be bad, or you could have a short.

I'm not sure but the PCM could shut down the voltage supply to the PS.

Let me know what you find out.
Aug 18, 2019 at 12:02 PM (Merged)