Codes P0441, P0442, and P0446

2003 TOYOTA ECHO
120,000 MILES • 1.5L • 4 CYL • 2WD • AUTOMATIC
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ACURSI16
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A week or two ago, I came to a stop at a stop light and the car stalled. All electrical systems stayed on. I was able to put the car in park and immediately start back up with seemingly no issues. No codes appeared in this instance so I'm not sure if it is related to my current problem. A few days later, the check engine light came on with the codes P0441, P0442, and P0446. The gas cap looked pretty bad, so I replaced it with a brand new one and reset the codes. Today, I was at a stop sign, began to accelerate and it was almost nonresponsive. Pressing the gas was only moving me forward a couple MPH, as if it wanted to stall. Then I floored it and that seemed to get it to respond. For a minute or two after that, if I let go of the gas pedal and then depressed it again, it was hesitant to respond but after a couple minutes it seemed to be driving normal. Maybe ten minutes later, the check engine light came on with the same codes mentioned. Any thoughts?
Apr 7, 2022 at 12:49 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

All of these codes are related to the emissions system (EVAP). There is likely a leak. In this case, I always recommend having the EVAP system smoke tested.

What a person will do is this. A small very low-pressure tool will be connected to a port for the EVAP system. Smoke is then pumped into the system at approximately 1 PSI. If there is a leak, the smoke will exit at that point.

I suggest this because otherwise, it will require extensive diagnostics. In most cases, this is the least expensive way to proceed.

Let me know if this helps or if you have questions.

Take care

Joe
Apr 7, 2022 at 8:00 PM
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ACURSI16
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Thank you very much. I'll give it a shot.
Apr 7, 2022 at 8:21 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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You are very welcome. Let me know what you find or if you have other questions.

Take care,

Joe
Apr 7, 2022 at 8:25 PM
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ACURSI16
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Found the leak. That is where the pipe that connects to the gas inlet goes to the tank. Is it at all possible to fix that? It's very loose as well. Do I need to replace the whole tank?
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Apr 8, 2022 at 6:37 AM
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ACURSI16
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I don't know if I diagnosed that correctly. I did not force the solenoid closed. I'm not sure if I have to or not. So, is it possible that that is not my issue?
Apr 8, 2022 at 7:41 AM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

If the fuel inlet is rusted through, that is the likely problem. You can replace just the fuel filler neck. If you look below, I provided a pic of it for you. I highlighted the Dorman part number. Chances are you can find it for less money.

Let me know if that helps.

Take care.

Joe

See pic below.
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Apr 8, 2022 at 6:06 PM
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ACURSI16
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Thank you. Thinking about it more, that hole might be the vent hole. I realized I have to clamp one of the hoses before doing the smoke test. So, I'm going to do that tomorrow to make sure before I order that.
Apr 8, 2022 at 6:28 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

Regardless if that is the vent, it will produce a leak and set the check engine light to turn on indicating an EVAP leak. Also, it can be dangerous if fuel can leak or if fumes are present. I would feel better knowing it's fixed, but that's your call. LOL

Take care of yourself and let me know what I can do to help.

Joe
Apr 8, 2022 at 6:39 PM
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ACURSI16
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That makes sense. I wasn't sure if it was actually normal, and I just wasn't sure what I was looking at. Thanks.
Apr 8, 2022 at 7:02 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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You are very welcome. Let me know what I can do to help.

Joe
Apr 8, 2022 at 9:25 PM
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ACURSI16
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It looks like you were right. Thanks for that. The filler neck was completely eroded into two parts. I ran the smoke test after replacing it and I no longer see any leak. Thanks again.
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Apr 9, 2022 at 11:12 AM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

Wow, that does look bad. If you have a scan tool, delete the codes and see if they return. I suspect they won't. However, if anything changes or I can help in any way, let me know.

Take care of yourself and please feel free to come back anytime in the future. You are always welcome here.

Joe
Apr 9, 2022 at 9:00 PM
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ACURSI16
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I appreciate it.
Apr 10, 2022 at 12:49 AM
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ACURSI16
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The codes came back. Same three codes. No other issues that I noticed. I've pretty much reached the limit of my diagnostic ability. Unless you have anything that might be easy to rule out.
Apr 14, 2022 at 7:31 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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The next thing is to smoke test the EVAP system. There must be an additional leak. By chance do you feel that is something you could have done? It requires a smoke machine for testing.

Let me know.

Joe
Apr 14, 2022 at 9:23 PM
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ACURSI16
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Yes, I did the smoke test. That's how I found the leak in the filler neck. I did the smoke test again after I replaced the filler neck and did not see any leak.
Apr 15, 2022 at 4:01 AM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Okay. That leads to a new list of diagnostics. Since the 441 and 446 are both present, we need to start there. The 442 isn't setting the light.

I have attached the extensive diagnostics below. I am hoping you won't need to go through all of them. Hopefully, the problem will present itself early in the procedure.

You will need a scanner that can communicate with the PCM.

Take a look through them. Don't be overwhelmed.
31

Let me know your thoughts.

Take care,

Joe

See pics below.
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Apr 15, 2022 at 7:04 PM
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ACURSI16
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Thanks for uploading those for me. I was worried I would need some better equipment. My scanner is just a simple code reader. I've got that code reader and a multimeter. I can do the smoke test and I have test leads. That's the extent of my diagnostic tools. Of course, I can rent whatever the auto parts store has available, but I don't think they have the good scanners. Looks like I'll have to take it to a pro. Thank you again.
Apr 15, 2022 at 7:18 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

Check to see if you can get one from a parts store. Hopefully, they will have what you need.

Regardless, let me know how things turn out for you. I'm interested in knowing.

Take care,

Joe
Apr 15, 2022 at 8:29 PM
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ACURSI16
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Will do. Thanks
Apr 16, 2022 at 2:54 AM
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ACURSI16
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So, I took it to a mechanic. There was a leak in the vapor canister. So, I'm going to replace that. My smoke test didn't show that leak because it doesn't pressurize the system. My question now is, would that possibly cause the stalling or near stalling that I described in my original post or do you think that is a separate issue?
Apr 20, 2022 at 4:54 PM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

That produces a vacuum-related issue and certainly can cause a rough idle and stalling.

Replace it since we know it's bad, and let's see how it runs.

Let me know.

Joe
Apr 20, 2022 at 8:46 PM
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ACURSI16
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Sounds good. Thanks
Apr 21, 2022 at 4:01 AM
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JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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You are very welcome. Let me know how it works out for you.

Take care,

Joe
Apr 21, 2022 at 3:45 PM