Engine noise

Mid way before warm, loud.

Raising the RPMs, it kinds of goes away then gets loud. Also turned it off and on again, a lot of the noise was gone.

When you first turn it off then turn back on its almost 100% gone then slowly comes back at a minimum.

Fully warm.

Hi,

I would suggest pulling the valve covers and check for a loose rocker. The hydraulic lifters are adjustable so you can adjust the valve lash by bleeding the hydraulic lash adjuster. However, I feel if you find the loose one, it will need to be replaced. Regardless, you can try bleeding it.

Also, here is a link that explains different sounds from an engine. Take a look through it and see if anything seems to fit.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/engine-noises

Listening to the sound, it sounds like an issue with a rocker. That is why I'm suggesting the adjustment/bleeding.

If you look at the pics below, they are the directions for adjusting lash. Also, I don't feel it is something with the camshaft (yet) because it goes away. A bad lobe wouldn't change.

Let me know what you find or if you have other questions.

Take care,

Joe

See pics below.

I see. Makes sense. I did a lot if 3.6l engines as far as lifters changing but never did anything on a 3.5, is this something common?

Hi,

I don't feel that it is a common problem, but that is what it sounds like. The only problem is this. Listening to a recording isn't the same as being there. However, it does sound related to a lifter issue. The easiest thing to do is remove the valve cover and inspect things. I suspect that is where the issue is because it doesn't sound like a bearing issue.

Let me know if you have questions or if there is something I can do to help.

Joe

I agree with Joe. You need to start some sort of tear down. I had a similar issue on a 2.7L engine. I removed the valve cover and actually found a bad chain tensioner with a broken chain guide and stripped threads. Here is a link to some videos I posted. Hope this will guide you and give you an idea as what to look for.

https://www.2carpros.com/questions/chrysler-300-engine-noise

Hope the videos help you and please update so we know if you need further assistance, or you found what the issue is.

And to my surprise the car is still actually running since I have not gotten the parts to properly finish the repair.

I removed the lifter assembly, is this normal? I have seen a lot of videos attributing the sound to this. Many of them are this loose.

I changed that one side of assembly as far as rockers because it was just eaten and loose, but i removed the timing belt cover and the belt is just too lose in my opinion, but not sure how it can cause such noise.

Hi,

Wow! The belt is way too loose. As far as the rocker arms, they will move, but what I'm seeing seems excessive.

As far as the timing belt, chances are the tensioner is bad. It has a hydraulic tensioner. In your video, the side of the belt you are moving wraps around the water pump, so you should inspect that as well. Actually, if you replace the belt, it is a good idea to replace the water pump at the same time. That way, the chances of you needing to do the job again in the near future are lower.

I'm not sure what your intentions are with the vehicle. If you plan to keep it, I would replace the timing belt and tensioner. It will jump time the way it presently is. I'm surprised it hasn't already. Please keep in mind this engine (3.5L V6) is an interference engine. If the belt breaks while it's running, it will likely cause internal damage.

When you replaced the rocker assembly, did that side quiet down?

If you look below, I attached the directions for the removal and replacement of the timing belt. I'm adding it in the event you want to change it. (I do recommend it) but that's your call.

Let me know if this helps.

Take care.

Joe

Not keeping it, just want to change the tensioner and send it to auction. I can't really tell if it did quiet down or not as the sound is everywhere and only way for me to tell if after its warm for 20-25 minutes which is when it quiets down and i didn't want to wait that long. Is the tensioner held with one big boot from the bottom? Also, i guess i need to turn the motor a bit so the loose end if the belt is by the tensioner? Easiest way to make sure the marks are lined up?

Not sure why it is showing two different types.

Hi,

The second pic looks correct. The end is depressed and being held in by a locking pin. That gets removed once it's installed. I attached a pic from my manual showing what it should look like. See pic 1 below.

The tensioner is located right above and to the left of the crankshaft pulley. See pic 2. Pic 3 shows the tensioner depressed and the locking pin installed.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have other questions. Also, make sure to check the water pump for bearing issues when it's apart.

Let me know if I can help.

Take care,

Joe

See pics below.

Yes, i was confused but one was the tensioner pulley not the tensioner. Car doesn't have any issues overheating and the belt looks good, water pump spins smoothly. Will just change that tensioner.

Can you do me a favor and confirm to me that the bolts to the rocker arm assembly torque at 23 in-lb?

Hi,

That doesn't sound right. Take a look below. I highlighted what I believe you are referring to. Let me know if this is what you needed. Also, it shows the sequence in which the bolts should be tightened.

Note, the torque is indicated in inch-pounds. If you convert 275 in/lbs to foot-pounds, it comes up as 23 ft/lbs.

If you only tightened them to 23 in/lbs, that is extremely loose. That works out to just under 2 ft/lbs

Let me know if this helps or if you have other questions.

Take care,

Joe

See pic below.

Holy smoke, yes i did 23 in/lbs, saw it online, but really 23ft/lb?

I thought he meant 23 in/lbs here.
https://youtu.be/0YnoH7mV_3g

Hi,

I just listened. Instead of saying foot-pounds, he said feet pound really fast. I had to listen twice.

If you leave them at 23 in/lbs, it's going to come loose.

Take care and let me know if I can help in any way.

Joe

Is there a special holding tool for the crankshaft pulley? I tried to find one T advance auto, but they don't have one for this car.

Or maybe it doesn't need to remove it actually, i turned the crank until the loose part of the belt is around the tensioner, i can the the move the tensioner and install the new one, correct?

I also checked on the new assembly i installed, i did torque it to 23 ft/lbs not in/lbs as it didn't make sense, i just forgot that i did.

Hi,

Good to hear about the torque. Also, you shouldn't need a special tool. If you are able to replace the tensioner with the removal of the belt, just make sure the timing marks are in the correct positions when you put it back together.

What I would do is get all marks aligned. Then, install the new tensioner and recheck the marks.

Let me know.

Joe

So, is it okay to turn the harmonic with the tensioner off? I forgot to do so before i removed it, i can't remove the belt as i don't have a way of getting the crank pulley off.

Hi,

Only turn the crank if the belt is attached and timed correctly. The engine is an interference engine, and you don't want to damage valves or pistons. The only way to turn it independently (crank only) the rocker arm assembly needs to be removed so none of the valves are open or can open.

Let me know exactly what is happening. I may have a few tricks up my sleeve. LOL

Take care,

Joe

The belt is still on but not the tensioner. I would not like to install the tensioner to then find out am out a tooth. Is the mark on the crank pulley as well or i got to remove it to see it?

I think i will remove both rocker assemblies, and have both cams lined up, and do the sane for the crank, but is there a mark on these harmonic balancers? How can i remove the pulley without a special tool as it will turn if i try to do so?

Guessing while both rocker assemblies off. I can turn the camshafts to line them up with no issues since nothing would cause them to open and hit the cylinders.

Hi,

If the rocker assemblies are removed, you can turn the cams or the crank independently. As far as the harmonic balancer/crank pulley, I don't believe there is a mark on it. Check to see if there is a small V cut out of the pulley. If there is, then check to see if there is an indicator on the timing cover. If both are missing, it needs to be removed.

All you need is a standard wheel puller. Most parts stores will lend one to you.

I attached the directions below for the removal of the pulley.

Let me know if this helps or if you have other questions.

Take care,

Joe

See pics below.

Does this look right?
And i guess i don't have to worry about valves for now since they are all closed, meaning even if i rotate the cam 180 degrees now it won't matter, right?
What about the crankshaft mark, how do i confirm its TDC and not 180 degrees off as it is, all yellow marks are from previous installation and i aligned them all. Once the tensioner is on the left cam will pull a bit to the left to align.

Yes, with all valves closed, you can rotate it. As far as the timing marks, the left bank does look slightly off, but I do see play in the belt. Also, I can't see the crankshaft for certain (pic 4) because of the angle.

As long as the crankshaft marks are good, you won't be 180 out.

Joe

Thanks. Hmm, i heard that you can be off 180 on some engines even with the mark lined up, unless am mistaken.

And so, if i release the tensioner I am off one tooth I'm bumming, lol.

If it is one tooth off, it won't run properly. If it is one tooth off, release the tensioner and move the pulley so it aligns.

Once you get it back together (rocker assemblies) turn the engine a few revolutions by hand to make sure it turns easily.

Take care,

Joe

Am done. So, it's much quieter now. Still hear a bit but that may have to do with mileage and lower oil and pressure comparing it to one with lower mileage.

See if you can tell the difference between this one and the first video i posted. Very strange that without a belt no lights on the dash.

Hi,

Wow, that sounds a lot better. Was the engine warm in that video? I listened to the first ones you sent, and it certainly is quieter.

Let me know.

Joe

Half way warm, didn't want to make it fully warm until i add some coolant and install the fans.

I think you got it taken care of. Also, if it was low on coolant, I don't blame you for not wanting to let it reach operating temperature.

Regardless, great job. I'm glad you got it fixed. Please feel free to come back anytime in the future if you have questions or need help.

Take care,

Joe