removing the engine

Yes. With vans that usually how it's done. Disassemble front clip, lift and slide engine out the front door.

Thanks, But has it actually been done with a windstar??

This is what our reference shows for engine removal:
ENGINE - 3.0L V6 -1999 Ford Windstar
Page 1 of 1
Removal (Windstar)

1.
Disconnect negative battery cable. Drain cooling system. Discharge A/C system using approved refrigerant recovery/recycling equipment. Remove top cowl vent panel. Disconnect alternator
wiring connections. Remove air cleaner and intake duct assembly. Disconnect upper radiator hose at radiator. Disconnect heater hoses. Disconnect A/C compressor hoses from receiver-drier and
condenser. Plug openings.
Disconnect control cables from throttle body. Remove accelerator cable bracket from throttle body, and position aside. Release fuel pressure. Disconnect fuel supply and return lines. See
FUEL PRESSURE RELEASE & FUEL LINE CONNECTIONS.
Disconnect engine control wire harness from Powertrain Control Module (PCM). Disconnect other wire harness connectors and ground wires as necessary. Disconnect necessary vacuum and
water hoses. Remove transmission shifter cable.
2.
3.
CAUTION: Damage to steering column air bag wiring can result if steering
wheel is allowed to rotate too far in either direction.
4.
Lock steering wheel with wheels in straight-ahead position. Raise and secure vehicle. Remove front wheel assemblies. Drain engine oil. Disconnect transmission cooler lines from transmission.
NOTE:
Do not let flex connector of dual-converter "Y" pipe to hang
unsupported.
5.
Remove dual-converter "Y" pipe. Disconnect starter motor wiring and remove starter. Remove torque converter-to-flywheel nuts. Remove battery cable support. Disconnect power steering
cooler hoses and lower radiator hose. Remove auxiliary heater hoses (if equipped).
Remove upper sway bar link bolts. Separate steering knuckles from front struts. Remove steering coupling pinch bolt from intermediate shaft. Remove intermediate shaft from steering gear.
Remove both axle shafts. See FWD AXLE SHAFTS - VILLAGER & WINDSTAR article in DRIVE AXLES.
Support subframe, engine and transaxle assembly with Rotunda Powertrain Lift (014-00765) and Adapter (014-00341). Remove 4 front subframe retaining bolts. Partially lower engine, transaxle
and subframe from vehicle as an assembly. Disconnect power steering hoses. Disconnect remaining electrical connections. Remove assembly from vehicle and disassemble as necessary.
6.
7.

© 2008 Mitchell Repair Information Co., LLC.
http://www.ondemand5.com/mric/common/asp/printart.aspx
1/24/2012

Engine Mechanical problem
1999 Ford Windstar 6 cyl Front Wheel Drive Automatic

does the engine come from the bottem

yes, you must lower the engine with transaxle and front sub-frame assembly attached

I answered a similar question so I'm copying from another (my) recent post:

You're in for a real treat if you decide to swap a Windstar engine. I've done a few... here's a few items to look out for.

For safety's sake, I remove the radiator fans and radiator. You'll be happy to have the extra maneuvering space when you have the engine hoisted halfway out of the engine bay. Of course, removal of the radiator requires removal of the front bumper and headlight skeleton/frame. Be ready for some minor bodywork removal.

Remove the plastic decorative frame at the windshield and the other frame below it which holds the windshield wiper linkages. You'll be amazed at how much extra space this gives all of a sudden when it's gone.

Remove the crank harmonic balancer, belt tensioner, and water pump pulley. You'll need the space between the engine and chassis frame when separating the engine from the tranny. (To clear the flex plate from the tranny torque converter).

The transmission wraps around from the driver side to the passenger side near the firewall. Don't forget there are some hard-to-get-to tranny-to-engine block mounting bolts on the passenger side... look thru the passenger side wheel well to access them.

The exhaust system is most annoying in my opinion. Detaching the exhaust pipe from the exhaust manifold at the firewall side (Cyl's 1-2-3) is remarkably difficult unless you have very nimble hands and wrists that bend in all kinds of awkward positions.

Make sure you don't damage the exhaust heat shield which protects the vehicle speed sensor. You don't want that sensor going bad due to heat after you finish your engine swap. Just look thru the wheel well at how well it is hidden behind the engine mount and sandwiched between the engine block and tranny/cV-Joint output shaft.

I've actually found it more convenient to remove the engine and tranny as a connected set from the engine bay instead of trying to detach the engine from the tranny inside the car. Using this step, though, keep in mind you need to remove the CV joints and a few extra wiring harness connections.

Some mechanics manuals INSIST that the engine needs to be removed by lifting the entire car, dismounting the subframe from the body, and lowering the entire front subframe with engine/tranny attached. ...Nah. Don't believe it.

I don't remove the hood; don't find it necessary. It pivots out of the way enough to clear the engine and hoist. The brake master cylinder sometimes gets in the way when you pull the engine and tranny out as a set, but you can twist the engine while on the sling for the tranny case to clear it.

I can't elaborate on the other hundreds of details to look out for such as wiring harness connections and EVAP lines... just label everything before disconnection, take pictures, put your bolts in seperate plastic containers... so that when you're ready to re-install, you have everything in order.

Have fun.

Is it very hard to swap out a engine? I feel confident enough to be mechinially incline and problem solve. Any thing to look out for?

You're in for a real treat if you decide to swap a Windstar engine. I've done a few... here's a few items to look out for.

For safety's sake, I remove the radiator fans and radiator. You'll be happy to have the extra maneuvering space when you have the engine hoisted halfway out of the engine bay. Of course, removal of the radiator requires removal of the front bumper and headlight skeleton/frame. Be ready for some minor bodywork removal.

Remove the plastic decorative frame at the windshield and the other frame below it which holds the windshield wiper linkages. You'll be amazed at how much extra space this gives all of a sudden when it's gone.

Remove the crank harmonic balancer, belt tensioner, and water pump pulley. You'll need the space between the engine and chassis frame when separating the engine from the tranny. (To clear the flex plate from the tranny torque converter).

The transmission wraps around from the driver side to the passenger side near the firewall. Don't forget there are some hard-to-get-to tranny-to-engine block mounting bolts on the passenger side... look thru the passenger side wheel well to access them.

The exhaust system is most annoying in my opinion. Detaching the exhaust pipe from the exhaust manifold at the firewall side (Cyl's 1-2-3) is remarkably difficult unless you have very nimble hands and wrists that bend in all kinds of awkward positions.

Make sure you don't damage the exhaust heat shield which protects the vehicle speed sensor. You don't want that sensor going bad due to heat after you finish your engine swap. Just look thru the wheel well at how well it is hidden behind the engine mount and sandwiched between the engine block and tranny/cV-Joint output shaft.

I've actually found it more convenient to remove the engine and tranny as a connected set from the engine bay instead of trying to detach the engine from the tranny inside the car. Using this step, though, keep in mind you need to remove the CV joints and a few extra wiring harness connections.

Some mechanics manuals INSIST that the engine needs to be removed by lifting the entire car, dismounting the subframe from the body, and lowering the entire front subframe with engine/tranny attached. ...Nah. Don't believe it.

I don't remove the hood; don't find it necessary. It pivots out of the way enough to clear the engine and hoist. The brake master cylinder sometimes gets in the way when you pull the engine and tranny out as a set, but you can twist the engine while on the sling for the tranny case to clear it.

I can't elaborate on the other hundreds of details to look out for such as wiring harness connections and EVAP lines... just label everything before disconnection, take pictures, put your bolts in seperate plastic containers... so that when you're ready to re-install, you have everything in order.

Have fun.

I have a 1998 Ford Windstar 3.0 liter engine I would like to change it with a 2002 Windstar 3.8 liter engine is it possible please answer

you can do it only if the components are similar or the same and computer connections can be made. it may run a little different than it should due to not the correct computer. and you'll have to see if both are balanced the same so you don't end up with the wrong torque converter otherwise it will shake.

good shape. it was given 2 me .want 2 know if it is worth finding a used motor? if so i was told that some taurus motors will work if so which ones? please can u help? know nothing about ford vans or that year & model. thanks

Hi:
I strongly recommend staying with a direct fit engine. When you change years and models, sensors, mounts... change and it usually causes nothing but headachs.

Let me know if you have other questions.

Joe

THE BAD and the UGLY: I was debating replacing the Cat Converter Y-Pipe and I got little input on whether I should from my trusted shop. At first they said it should be replaced if I saw it glow red (which I did) and then another day they said to leave it until we know its bad which you wouldn't know until the new engine was in. I have looked at it a few times and once at night since getting it back and its NOT glowing red down there so I can only assume things are flowing out the exhaust as they should but I am skeptical because of the following stuff.

ENGINE TAPPING - TO ME (and I've heard plenty of healthy engines) the engine just does NOT SOUND RIGHT. I don't know if this is normal for a NEW engine or what the deal is, but it just does NOT sound right. It almost reminds me of the sound I heard on the old engine after it had overheated. The new engine came with a full new long block so any thought of any old part of the engine being there should be out of the mind.... but it just sounds similar to the old engine ONLY after it had overheated. The old engine before overheating sounded and ran fine without this TAPPING sound. I asked the mechanic who put the engine in and he said that some engines do it and some don't. I mean is it really that simple???? or could the TIMING be off or something?

OIL PRESSURE or OIL LEVEL or BOTH - I do not know what weight oil they put in the engine, but I do know its over-filled (something I hate that shops do) maybe by 1/4 to 1/2 quart. The engine oil pressure light (I guess thats what it is) or oil LEVEL light (looks like a lil oil tipping container with an oil drop off its end) keeps FLICKERING and seems to do this ONLY when at IDLE in Drive or in Park. I've never seen a dash light FLICKER like this so I am hoping its the sensor just needing adjustment.

WHINING after shutting it off after having driven 5 to 10 miles or less even. I have heard this sound somewhere on YouTube and I think it was a Windstar. The guy would shut off his engine and you'd hear this WHINE sound as if someone was slowly letting air out of a balloon when you'd squeeze the lips of one together to make that sound. A person on YouTube said this was the guys CAM going bad. IF THIS IS TRUE THIS IS REALLY GONNA PISS ME OFF.. LOL ... SINCE ITS A NEW ENGINE. It will not do this whine if I just run it in place.... it'll only do it after I drive it around a few miles and maybe even after up to 70mph for a bit. I used to hear this SAME EXACT SOUND with the old engine, BUT ONLY after driving in excess of 200 - 300 miles of continuous travel. All I used to think back then was that the damn thing was just OLD and needed a COOL off break. Does ANYONE have any idea on this?

A/C CLUTCH metal rubbing noise - I don't know if this is just normal break-in for a new a/c clutch ASSEMBLY (all parts of it; the kit), but there appears to be a sliding/skimming metal sound when the clutch kicks OFF (not ON). This is normally heard at IDLE only and when I move along in DRIVE it goes away. NORMAL for new? or Not properly torqued bolts on this?

CHURPING - THE MYSTERIOUS pulley/belt churping is BACK after I had finally f'ing eliminated it before bringing it back to the trusted shop for engine installation. ALL PULLEYS are NEW now except the alternator pulley and perhaps the crank pulley which I guess got transferred over from the old engine. They went and bought a new belt even though I already had a new belt on there and told them so on the list and in person. I don't know what made them think the churping was gone cause it certainly isn't but even when the engine was in misfire and overheating condition when I brought it back to them it NO LONGER SQUEAKED or CHURPED after the water pump had been replaced at the FORD dealership in Mississippi where I originally got stuck which prompted all of this (new engine). After all this money put in I almost want to replace the alternator or just its pulley just to see if the damn squeaking/churping will go away for good since all other components except the crank pulley have been replaced unless there is another pulley than the tensioner, idler, a/c, & ps pump.

In the 4 days they claimed they had to drive the van after telling me it was running they only drove it 13 miles. I don't even know if they took it out on the interstate, but I cannot see how they would've done a thorough drivability inspection not having noticed what I have. After what I have spent (and it was more than they'd told me cause they found other things that were definitely in need of replacing like the brake lines, rad hoses, etc..) I would've expected perfection, but I guess thats stupid cause its never the case.

QUESTIONS:

Basically what all could cause the stuff from the above section? I would like to have some ideas of what to tell the shop when i bring the van back on Monday morning.

What REALLY gets me though is that I cannot complain AT ALL because there is nothing to complain about as far as the van's OPERATING ability is concerned. It is simply not PHYSICALLY doing ANYTHING wrong. It drives/feels beautifully now, but these things of course in the BAD section bother me.

WOW!! I am amazed and impressed that you have kept your cool after all this. Way to go! I worked at a Ford dealership for many years, so I would be happy to share with you what I think.
First: If the cat converters have been hot enough to glow red, they probably should be replaced anyway as they will no longer be effective in doing their job. But if they were glowing, its possible that the muffler could be causing the restriction.
Second: Remember that this is a different engine than came out of the vehicle (at least that is what we are told) so it may sound different than the old one (but it sounds the SAME as the old). A certain amount of ticking is acceptable during the breaking period (300-500 miles). However, If they did not use proper priming procedure for a reman engine, they may have caused a slight amount of damage, enough to cause more ticking than normal. Proper priming is to disable the fuel pump and unplug the ignition coil and crank the engine in 10 second bursts about 20 seconds apart, repeating about three times. This ensures that the oil pump circulates oil throughout the engine before it is fired up to high RPM. The oil level should be anywhere between the area of the hash marks. Even if it is to the top of the hash marks it's not overfull.
Third: The oil pressure light should NOT be flickering. They need to put a manual gauge on the engine to determine if it does indeed have low oil pressure. Then go from there with repairs, as needed.
Fourth: How long does the whine noise last? It sounds like it may just be the A/C system bleeding off pressure.
Fifth: The A/C compressor should not be chirping on engagement/disengagement. If it does, they do not have the clutch shimmed correctly.
Sixth: The chirp noise that you hear may be related to the Alt as they are known for the bearings going bad. But you have another option. The Windstars do not have a Distributor. Instead, they have what is called a Camshaft Position Sensor (a.k.a. Syncronizer). Many of the syncros, when they go bad, sound like a pulley squeek. It is quite common for these to go bad. Have them isolate the noise before they replace anything.
If you have any other questions, you can PM me to ask them. I would be happy to help. I'm a perfectionist, so I'm with you: when you spend that much money, you expect it to be right (which unfortunately is different from perfect). Let me know what you find.

Its been hard to contain my cool... believe me.

1. It is OVER the hash marks maybe by about half the length of the distance between the low/top lines in the hash area.

2. It is a new reman engine which I now have learned is ATK. 3 year 100k mile warranty - I had ordered it myself and had it delivered to them.

3. I'm seriously considering getting a new cat. The only reason it was glowing red (which i know it was only doing for 100 miles) was cause a cylinder was missing and fuel wasn't getting burned up with the old engine on my way home.

4. I have no idea if they properly primed the engine or not, but they are my TRUSTED shop so I hope they did it right.

5. The whine noise lasts maybe 2 - 4 seconds tops before it "whines" down again like air coming out of a balloon when you've pinched the lips of it. I would hope its just the A/C and this would be better than the engine as the a/c is the only system left that hasn't been touched aside from the new clutch kit I had them put on the compressor during the engine install.

6. I don't believe its the A/C clutch thats churping. I bet you its the alternator pulley cause it looks like they BENT the alternator's arm where its mount bolt goes in... and the bend is EVER SO SLIGHT but I am wondering if this is deflecting the belt just a tad enough to cause this new churping.
What the A/C Clutch is definitely doing is RUBBING like a metal to metal sound between it kicking on and OFF.. during the OFF cycle its rubbing.

7. I was worried about sensors going bad or being bad when they'd swap them to the new engine as the previous sensors were on for 157k miles. If the camshaft position sensor is bad this may also explain why the engine doesn't SOUND like its running right with this TAPPING... almost loud or elevated TICKING form of sound.

THANK YOU SO MUCH MAN ! POST BACK ! I'm gonna PM ya !

In reguards to the A/C compressor rubbing, it is definetly not shimmed out correctly. There are different small "washers" that should have come with the kit. The spacing between the clutch and the pulley has a certain spec. It sounds like it's under spec and therefor rubbing. Either that or they bent that pulley also. Keep posting your finds!

I'm dropping my van off back at the shop this morning with the following note. I will post back what happens too. Note to my shop:

*I need the van back as soon as possible as we are supposed to use it for a trip on the 22nd (Saturday)

UNFINISHED WORK & PROBLEMS SINCE ENGINE INSTALL:
1. OIL PRESSURE LIGHT FLICKERS - After a 5 minute drive on the interstate at 70mph and then through town for about 30 more minutes when coming to a stop or in park at IDLE the oil pressure light flickers on/off very quickly and eventually goes off completely. PLEASE CHECK THE OIL PRESSURE WITH A TESTING TOOL. SUGGEST DRIVING IT round-trip on interstate laplace exits and back to get the light to come on.
2. ENGINE DOES NOT SOUND RIGHT. It should not be tapping like it is. Suspect bad oil pressure. Timing right? What weight OIL was used? I wanted 5w20 as per the parts list I provided because that is what FORD calls for it now.
3. OIL LEVEL OVER FULL MARK by ¼ - ½ quart. Correct mistake.
4. A/C Clutch is not properly shimmed – metal rubbing metal; drags when clutch switches OFF; PLEASE MEASURE THE SPEC WIDTH FOR CLUTCH and correct mistake.
5. CHURPING FROM THE PULLEY SYSTEM - I WANT THIS GONE AS I DID NOT BRING IT IN WITH THIS PROBLEM. A GUESS was made to install a new belt where I already had a new belt installed so now I have 2 extra BACKUP belts and the churping is still there. IT WAS NOT THE BELT and for $55 I feel it was an unreasonable remedy as it did not work.
Suspect alternator pulley, crankshaft pulley, or water pump pulley as those are the only OLD ones left. Have heard of bearings failing in alternator pulley’s on these vans. I will deliver new alternator pulley to the shop for installation when you fix the A/C Clutch that is rubbing unless you can get an alternator pulley for $15 or less.
6. ALIGNMENT OFF – PULLS LEFT. Correct mistake.
7. Loud deminishing WHINE (like air coming out of a balloon mouth while stretched) comes from the van after turning it OFF. I have experimented with this and think it could be the A/C letting off air pressure. I just want to know if this is what it is. I do not have the money to contend with opening the a/c system and will be fine if I know it’s the A/C rather than the camshaft as I’ve heard a camshaft going bad can make this sound, but this doesn’t make sense since its NEW.
8. TIE ROD ENDS – I delivered tie rod ends to you in the parts box along with a PARTS LIST to avoid ONE HUNDRED DOLLAR tie rod ends and I saw after the fact they are on the bill. What happened to the tie rod ends I delivered?

Shop confirms low oil pressure. I think they Said it got down to 15 psi after a quick 5 minute interstate trip after coming to a stop or in park. So now the engine manufacturer has to be involved to pay for repairs to the engine just installed. I would assume its likely the oil pump is bad or something is blocking oil flow. The shop put in a new oil pressure sending unit to be sure and it wasn't that.

They also said they will be answering ALL of my other questions as well tomorrow morning.

What about the cat on the rear bank.. if its clogged.... could this cause a low oil pressure situation? I had debated on replacing it till the new engine installation, but was told I wouldn't know if it was bad till the new engine was installed. It had in fact glowed red for about 100 miles on the way home due to misfiring cylinder. I didn't know it was glowing red till I got home. Though the van has ran since then with the new engine installed .... should I be considering this as a possible culprit?

I read elsewhere too that the alternator or battery could be going bad and cause the low oil pressure light to come on and I recall now after getting it back that it took a tiny big longer to start a couple times and I noticed it... thinking that it'd sat for so long in a no start condition it could've drained the battery down.... though it is a new battery as of this year. What ya'll think?

With respect to the cats causing low oil pressure, probably not. There are usually two main things that cause low oil pressure. LOW OIL PRESSURE, and an engine about to stall out from low idle. If your cat was plugged and was causing the engine to idle aroud 300-400 RPM's then it might be the cause. But since your engine is running correctly (outside of the noise) it is unlikely that this is the cause. If you had a battery failing, I think you would have other issues with the vehicle as well. The Windstars have multiple computers that would begin to act stupid if voltage drops below 10.5 volts. If they have confirmed low oil pressure at 15 psi, you may have just found the cause of most of your concerns.

I need some help here. I'm having problems liaison-ing between the shop and the remanufacturer of the engine. Can someone please verify what the engine oil pressure should be for my 1995 3.8L Ford Windstar in the following conditions:

Oil pressure at 750 - 1400rpms hot and cold idle
Oil pressure at 2500rpms hot

Please if someone could go measure this on a Windstar of 95 year that would be great, but 96 - 2003 is fine too. I need this information immediately so I can be armed to talk to the remanufacturer.

Could the screen/pickup have been installed WRONG some kind of way to restrict oil flow?

I am now the f'in liaison between the installer and the remanufacturer as they don't seem to be able to communicate well and we're going on 5 weeks with the van in the shop. The remanufacturer ensists it is NOT the oil pump as the engine was hot tested before it left their facility. If this is actually TRUE then it would make me look at the stuff that was manually done during the install...... like the scree/pickup - I don't know what they dude on the phone was telling me exactly, but something to the effect that the screen could be installed wrong in such a way that it would act like a sponge..... something to do with it not being seated right with the sealant... I dunno.... Anybody? Does that make sense at all that the screen could've been installed improperly to cause oil flow restriction in a new engine?

My shop had wondered on an outloud guess that maybe the engine installer had not replaced the valve train. I just can't believe this would be true with such a big name like ATK.. but maybe.

Ford Windstar 1995 GL 3.8L engine - 157k miles

I am toying with the idea of having the engine replaced in my vehicle. In your ANSWER ASSUME I have an unlimited BUDGET (seriously) and I'll pick off things that I don't want to do later on. Basically I want to know what things I should have them do because they are going to touch so many things that haven't been disturbed in so long.

Which components of the A/C system are likely to be clogged and should be replaced.... or could they be flushed... like the condenser? Evaporator? I know I should replace my expansion valve and DRIER, but I don't know if the other components would be dirty and need replacing too. I definitely want to replace the clutch coil, hub, and pulley of the compressor with a new revised Ford one cause it gets rid of the moaning and my clutch currently takes a long while to ENGAGE so I know I need to get that out of the way. Was thinking though by the time I get those 3 parts maybe new compressor would be better to do instead...... though currently my air works WONDERFULLY after it does finally kick on about 10 - 15 seconds after the A/C is turned on.

Steering - I believe I should do all tie rods.... what about the control arms, bushings, and ball joints? Anything else? Should I just replace the whole rack? It makes A LOT OF NOISE when turning to the left in PARKED position.... likely cause it hasn't been lubed in too long. I have a new PS Pump, but I don't think they replaced the filter.... what else in steering?

Body/Subframe - I read on consumerguideauto.howstuffworks.com the following for all 95 and 96 Windstars: Engine noise: A clunk heard and/or felt from the floor on acceleration, deceleration, or turns is caused by movement between the body and subframe, which is corrected by installing revised insulators. (1995-96)

Is REVISED INSULATOR between body and subframe what I CALL it when I call FORD or what is the technical term for these thingies?

What else in general?

THANK YOU !!!!

Also, I got most of my ideas from reading here how it would be to remove/reinstall my engine:

I know it seems like I may have covered everything, but I'm not experienced enough (while I have knowledge) to know if I'm missing something else. The following things have recently been replaced and would transplant to the new engine:

Water pump
Thermostat
Radiator
Tensioner and Pulley
Ilder Pulley
Belt
PS Pump
Alternator ground strap replaced with a cable (same old alternator still going strong though should I replace its pulley?)
Starter
Battery
Brake calipers and rotors (front) (pads with good life left)
Plugs and Wires are fairly new, but plugs will probably be replaced (though due to overheating should I replace the wires anyway???)

Ok, this was/is a complete LONG BLOCK as far as I'm concerned. All that needed to be bought for it was a pilot bushing and the oil pickup which the shop DID BUY NEW and did NOT transfer from the old engine.

The only other things that weren't with the new engine were SENSORS, external parts like alternator, power steering, pulleys, etc... which is standard for moving over as far as I'm concerned. The only internal stuff was what I mentioned in the paragraph above.

ATK is the name of the company that I bought from and NO it is not the company that my shop uses. They wanted me to get JASPER and while I would've loved to it was another $1300 more. I know the story yada yada... look at me now having problems and would've been worth it... yada yada.. but ya know what.... NO. It wouldn't have been worth it to me to spend another $1300 even though its not running right cause at this point the shop and the engine co are finally working together after nearly 2 f'in weeks to fix the problem.

After they put a gauge on the thing and tested it out it turns out that at idle after you've warmed up the oil quite a bit on the interstate and then coming to a stop in town traffic the pressure is going down to 10 psi and then the engine starts tapping..... BUT on the interstate or regular highway its getting up to freaking 90 PSI. The SHOP and the ENGINE CO agree that this is the symptoms of a bad front timing cover which also includes the OIL PUMP and/or possible debris caught in the cover. MY shop PROBED the engine co and found out they DO NOT REPLACE that cover, but they do SPEC IT OUT (i guess that means measure stuff and make sure its up to spec and/or clean it well too, but apparently they didn't). So the plan now is to remove the front timing cover and oil pump assembly and replace it with a new one from Ford at the ENGINE CO's expense. Had they done their damn job properly to begin with this would of course be unnecessary.

I do have to agree with what someone said in this page though... that how could they have HOT TESTED the engine if they didn't have the pan and if they did why wouldn't they just send it along? WEIRD... unless they just have a TEST PAN that they keep on hand for such use.

What gets me though is that the SHOP ever released the van to me in this condition and I think the main reason why is because it is hard to get a pressure tester in that oil sending unit area just to read the pressure.

As for the other issues, the churping, scraping a/c clutch, pulling to the left, etc.. they haven't said anything I HOPE only because the engine issue is the main issue to finish first.

We shall see. I will post back.

For those of you who've been following my horrible life since I broke down in my Windstar in October 2007 it has now finally gotten as bad as it can get. The engine co. is being very shady.

I need help with keywords or the TYPE of lawyer that would handle a suit for a case upwards from $3000 regarding this engine matter.

Basically ATK that authorized the oil pump and housing repair because they said they'd pay for it nows claims they WILL NOT pay for it because it did not resolve the pressure issue in the engine. This means I am out ALL of the R&R expense for the engine and an additional $500 for the oil pump/housing repair and other analysis including Discharging the damn A/C system which I was going to avoid... but was unavoidable cause of the pressure test needed with the master gauge at the oil sending unit location.

So if anyone knows.... please... what type of lawyer am I looking for here. I am in Southern Louisiana (New ORleans area) so if anyone knows anyone specific down here that would handle this for me I'd really appreciate it.

Someone please respond. This is the part where I need help the most as the remanufacturer is denying the engine is defective.

Here is the failure analysis report I got back from ATK just a couple days ago after sending them back the engine along with MUCH documentation and a DVD of the engine running in DEFECTIVE state. I have removed personal information on both sides (just fyi):
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jan 29 11:40 2008 ATK North America, Page 1


Atk North America Claim#
Product Failure Analysis Report

Thank you for submitting you ATK Product for inspection. Below
Please find the failure analysis report for your warranty claim.

*** ALL PRODUCT WILL BE HELD FOR 60 DAYS FROM THE DATE OF THIS REPORT ***

Administrator:

Claim#:
Part#: DFM7
Miles: 20
Months: 1
Engine#: Z703246


- -

Inspection Date: 01/28/08
Claim Status: Not Approved

Reported Failure:
Oil light on veh is flickering at warm idle. shop replaced oil sending unit
.attempted to reach shop/tech. too busy. left message on retail cell# v.mai

Inspectors Findings
Received engine with timing cover and oil pump.

All bearings not worn, clearances within limits. All lifters checked okay
with proper bleed down rate, all gallery plugs present.
Piston/cyl. wall .0023", cam bearings .0023", balance shaft bearings
.0015", main bearings .0023", crank end-play .004", rod bearings .0022",
rod side clearance .0085", oil pump gear to housing .003", gear to gear
.009", gear body .003".


No defect found to cause reported problem.

Someone please respond. This is the part where I need help the most as the remanufacturer is denying the engine is defective.

I have compared the reported measurements from ATK (above) to the FORD OEM specs from the FORD OEM service manual. The following shows the comparison. Please comment on it and give opinions to how you think the engine would run given the following reported findings against the OEM specs.

ATK inspection results | FORD OEM Specs/Wording

Piston/cyl. wall .0023" | Piston-to-bore Clearance (0.0014 - 0.0032 In.)

cam bearings .0023" | Journal to bearing clearance (0.001-0.003 In.)

balance shaft bearings .0015" | *Couldn't find it*

main bearings .0023" | Main bearings - Clearance to crankshaft - Desired: (0.001 - 0.0014 In.) Allowable: (0.0005 - 0.0023 In.)

crank end-play .004" | Crankshaft end play (0.004 - 0.008 In.)

rod bearings .0022" | Connecting rod bearings - Clearance to Crankshaft - Desired: (0.001 - 0.014 In.) Allowable: (0.00086 - 0.0027 In.)

rod side clearance .0085" | Side Clearance (assembled to Crank) - Standard: (0.0047 - 0.0114 In.) - Service Limit: (0.0.14 In Max)

oil pump gear to housing .003" | Drive shaft to housing Clearance (0.0030 - 0.0015 In.)

gear to gear .009" | Idler Shaft to Idler Gear Clearance (0.0017 - 0.0005 In.)

gear body .003" | Oil Pump Gear Radial Clearance (Idler and Drive) (0.0055 - 0.002 In.)

Did I match up my findings and the ATK results properly? If so it leads me to the following thoughts:

Cam bearing clearance is within 0.0007" of being out of spec, but at .0023" is within spec of (0.001-0.003 In.)

Rod bearing clearance is at the upper end of ALLOWABLE spec, but not in DESIRED spec and you'd think that if you remanufacture an engine that you'd have everything in the DESIRED spec range wouldn't you? Do ya'll think that would contribute to the problem I've been having with the extremely low oil pressure (10 - 14psi and tapping) at idle after engine has run for 30 minutes?

Main bearings were at .0023" | Clearance to crankshaft - Desired: (0.001 - 0.0014 In.) Allowable: (0.0005 - 0.0023 In.); This clearly shows the main bearing clearance being at the upper end of allowable on the verge of being out of spec allowing NO ROOM FOR HEAT EXPANSION. Would this not in part cause the oil pressure problem? Did they use the wrong bearings? Tolerances wrong? My shop seems to think that this is the main problem in the engine.

Rod side clearance was .0085" | Side Clearance (assembled to Crank) - Standard: (0.0047 - 0.0114 In.) - Service Limit: (0.014 In Max) - at .0085" its 0.0029 from being at the upper STANDARD limit though I don't know if this means anything or not. Might just be within a good range.

Gear body .003" | Oil Pump Gear Radial Clearance (Idler and Drive) (0.0055 - 0.002 In.) - If I've matched this one up right it seems to be out of spec by 0.001" too small. Wouldn't this affect the cycle/revolutions of the oil pump?

Oil pump gear to housing .003" | Drive shaft to housing Clearance (0.0030 - 0.0015 In.) - Seems this is at the upper limit of the spec, but maybe doesn't matter?

Gear to gear .009" | Idler Shaft to Idler Gear Clearance (0.0017 - 0.0005 In.) - If I have matched this up properly this would seem out of spec the most of the other measurements by 0.0073" too much. I think I have matched this up properly as there are no other descriptions/numbers that seem to match or come as close. If this is indicating spacing between gears wouldn't this extra space cause the oil pump to NOT turn as fast or spin at the right revolutions for a given engine RPM as well?

FYI - If anyone wants to compare or look up the values I've found if I've matched things up wrong and if someone can find the Balance shaft bearing clearance specification

I'll be honest, nothing jumps out at me and says, "Ah Ha!" The bearings may be on the high end of the spectrum, but they aren't enough to cause low oil pressure. Plus, I wonder, too, about the 90 PSI deal. This screams "Restriction after the pump." If the oil galleys in the block or crank are plugged, this might be the problem. What about the oil filter? Did they receive that also? Was it ever changed? The pump clearance does seem a little off, which might explain the Low oil pressure, but it wouldn't explain the High pressure. In my experience as a Ford tech, cold oil pressure should be 30-55 PSI, and hot oil pressure should be 18-24 PSI. I will get out my book that has all the 3.8 specs in it and post back this week end. Sorry I haven't kept up with you. I'm still figuring all the ways to keep tabs on my previous posts. I'm playing catch-up now. Will post back.
dave

Thanks a million Dave! I'll be waiting/watching.

Answering your questions:
The pressure condition can be shown here at the following links. If you download the video and watch it along with the supporting photos you'll see exactly what it was doing:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/mitchell1eautorepair-car-repair-manuals

The oil filter was of course brand spanking new and is of a brand the shop uses all the time with warranty support. To my knowledge since it was already new a new filter was not tried.

The main bearings were at the TOP of the allowable clearance range? You don't think that would be enough to cause the restriction?

Wouldn't the pump clearance being off cause it not to spin at the right revolutions?

Take a look at the video and photos. I'd suggest downloading first to your pc from the links above and then looking at them.

Thanks,
Rolland

RESOLUTION!!! At the threat of a lawsuit after I asked them who is their "Agent for Service of Process" (who do I serve papers to?) ATK came back at me a day or so later from that question and after I'd told them there is no way anyone could watch that DVD that I'd provided and say that engine is functioning properly I was made an offer to settle. As part of the offer I had to sign a legal release form stating the matter was closed and that I wouldn't sue'em later etc... I recovered $3511 in damages all on my own for what the entire debacle involved. I swear I could be an attorney. lol - The entire mess is now corrected/offset and I begin anew with a Jasper Engine which will arrive in the shop on Valentine's Day Feb 14th, 2008. LOL - Is this a sign? Is this engine gonna be so sweet I'll want to kiss it? From everything I've read/heard about Jasper I'm thinking so.

Thanks to all who read up on it and if you want to comment I'm still interested to know if my specs seemed off enough to cause unbalanced oil pressure to anyone who knows how to interpret the data.