what about the harness to the distributor????

Roy

are you talking about the wire running from the coil to the distributor?

from the coil to the points

Roy

Yes sir, I replaced this as well. It was the last thing I replaced thinking that I have missed something this simple. Also I have another simptom that may help diagnose the problem. When it was running, it would start just fine and run like a champ for 15 minutes but once it warmed up it would load up with fuel and backfire and want to cut off until it cooled back down. Then like I said it eventually cut off and now wont even spark out of the coil. I don't know if this helps???

when it wont start, is there still 12 volts to the plus side of the coil??

Roy

Yes, I have 12 volts to the plus side or post 15 of the coil but nothing coming out.

Coil "neg" needs to be able to get ground in the distributor via the points... scuff the points with a file or sandpaper.

Also make sure that the points actually get ground (mounted to the vacuum advance / retard plate... there should be a bare wire that is attached to the
plate and the distributor body.

Make sure the cam lobes have not worn flat.... you would have seen that though when checking / adjusting point gap.

Thomas

Attach a test light to coil "neg" and ground the other end to a good ground.

Key ON - light should be ON if points are open.

Turn engine by hand (turn alternator pulley)... light should go off / on whenever the points close / open.

If not, check what I posted above.

Thomas

Thomas, I have brand new points in and I will take your advice on scuffing the points. Would the suggestions you made have any bearing on why the coil is not throwing ANY spark? What I mean by this is i can pull the high voltage wire off the top of the distibutor, stick a screw driver in the wire, turn the engine over and it is throwing absolutly nothing out. Im not getting an arking spark at all. This is with the old and the new coil.

That's why you want to attach a test light to coil negative... it the light is always ON, then the points are not grounding out.

If the points don't ground out, no spark is produced.

Thomas

Great man!!! I appreciate your help on this. I will try this tomorrow during the day and report back here for sure to let you know. You can probably tell that I am not too mechanically inclined but let me see if I understand you correctly on the grounded points. When I purchased a set of new points, there was a wire already attached to them and then they plugged into a prong inside where the points set. Is this the grounding wire????

No, that wire attaches to the condensor wire, which attaches to the coil NEG terminal... this is still the "power" side.

The points mount to the distributor... there has to be metal to metal contact for the point to ground out.

Look for another wire... it should be bare and attached to the plate that the points attach to.

Thomas

Ok, Im going to run out and test this now with the test light and look for this wire. I will be back in a few. You have been very helpful and appreciate your time thusfar. I will be back in a few...............

Ok man, I don't what this means but the NEGATIVE or terminal 1 is not testing at all. I cannot get a light to come on period. The test light comes on with the wire on 15 or the ignition wire so my light is good and I have the ignition "on" but I cannot get the test light to come on at all on the negative side of the coil. I don't know what this means. I did turn the pulley to make sure that the points were not contacting or to make sure the engine was not in the cycle where the light should NOT be on. ??????

If the light does not come on, then that means your points (negative side of the coil) are always grounded.

To be sure, disconnect the green condenser wire from the coil... re-attach the test light to coil neg and see if the light now comes ON when the key
is ON.... if yes, then the coil is good, if no, then the coil has an open.

Thomas

My wire is red but it is the only one that runs from the side of the distibutor to the negative side of the coil so I believe you are referring to this wire. Yes, when I take this wire off and now nothing is attached to the negative side of the coil, the test light still does not come on. This is the new coil as well. Could this mean that the new coil is bad? Also, is there a way that I could test the old coil to see if it is bad without having to place it back in the vehicle?

Also, ya know my "know it all brother" came down when I first started having trouble with the car and just after I bought the new coil and he wanted to replace the coil (since he can do everything) and when he did he placed the ignition wire, originally to the Negative side of the coil and burned the set of NEW points up that I had in there then. Due to this, I had to go buy ANOTHER set of new points since it fried the wire that is inside attached to the points. Would this have possible fried the coil as well?

You are not using a magnetic pick-up are you? Usually the condenser wire is green.

You can do the same test with the old coil without mounting it. Just attach Ignition + wire to #15 and attach your test light to the - of the coil.

If you have time, take pictures of various components and post them here so I can see.

Thomas

You can install a coil backwards... it will not produce as much power, but should not burn out.

I am not sure about the magnetic pick up as to what his is. I will take pictures now and up load them. take me about 15 minutes

Electronic / magnetic points (do not require adjustment / do not wear out).

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=397477

Make sure the wire from the points to the condensor pin is not touching ground somewhere... or that the wire got crimped between
the distributor housing and the distributor cap.

Thomas

Found a picture of a ground wire in the distributor that I was talking about... circled in red in the attached file below.

Thomas

LOL... you didn't hook the reverse lights to the coil negative did you?

The reverse lights get power from coil + (#15)... I had a customer who connected it to coil neg. Engine died every time reverse gear was used.

Here are the pictures and no I don't have the type of points you are referring to. Does it sound as if my new coil is already bad?????

If the test light does not light up when attached to the coil neg (nothing else attached) and the key is ON, then yes, that coil primary circuit is burnt
out / has an open.

Try the old coil...

Is the bare wire in the distributor (circled above) OK?

Is your Idle Cut-off solenoid also on coil negative? That would be the problem!

If you would have not circled that ground wire I would have NEVER know what you were talking about. lol. I did find it hadn it is attached and not caught up in a bind. It does look old but it is attached at both ends and not severed. Also, I can't guarentee that I have never hooked up the back up lights to the negatvie side of the coil, but right now the only thing over there is the wire going to the points/condensor and on the positive side is the igniition, the back up lights, carburator, and the choke. Um one thing I did check is the ignition wire is giving me 12 volts and then there look like a ground that splits off this wire and grounds or goes to the bottom of the engine. Now, that wire has 12 volts on it also UNTIL i plug it to the ground (or whatever) then it drops to like 2.75 volts. I don't know if this is doing anything but............................

Sorry for the runaround...

Just talking it out to myself:

Coil + Power side:
- power wire from front
- backup light wire
- idle cut-off solenoid

Coil - Side:
- condenser wire
- tach (if equipped)

Remove any wires on the + side except for the actual power wire and the cut-off solenoid.

I'm not sure what other wire you are talking about that goes down to the engine (back-up lights possibly).

Re-test the old coil in the same way.

hey partner, good news!!!! I did the test on the old coil that you recommended and I DO get a solid light. Let me install it real quick and then go through the testing procedures you suggested. I have tried the old coil before and it still would not start but maybe using it will help me diagnose the other issue. hang tight

Bud, Finally its done and I know this is going to sound wiered as wierd can get but here is the deal. I replaced the coil (placed the coil in that was good), turned the engine on and I be dang if the dern test light WILL NOT come on again when I connect the to the negative side. What the heck? lol

You only have 1 wire attached to the coil at this time? The power wire... and the test light on the negative side of the coil?

Take a close-up picture of the ignition coil with wiring attached.

I'm on the west coast and can go for a while longer... if it's getting late for you, we can continue tomorrow.

Thomas

HOLD ON MY MAN. I think we are making some head way! The light DOES come on when I took off the condenser wire and just apply the light to the negative end of the coil. Does that mean the condensor wire is bad? It is a new condenser! But it may have burned up when my brother hooked it up backwards.

Yes... if the points are open but the light is OUT when the condenser is attached, then the condenser is shorted.

Good find!

Well right now, I don't have ANY wires attached to the negative side of the coil NOT even the condensor wire. The light comes on like this when I test it. However, when I plug the condenser wire up to the negative sid eof the coil and use the test light, the light will NOT come on... EVER. Does this mean I need a new condenser?

Remove the distributor cap and rotate the engine by hand... you need to see the points open and close as you rotate the engine.

If the light stays OFF while the points are OPEN, then yes, plug your old condenser in and give it a try.

Thomas

Take a picture of the distributor with the Rotor OFF... close-up of distributor.

I am going to call it a night. Sorry for taking so long to get back but I rushed to town real quick before the parts placed closed and bought another condeser real quick. I got home, installed it and it does the same thing which is, I can't get the test light to shine at all on the negative coil while the condenser wire is on the coil. If i take it off, it shines bright??????????????? I attached the picture you requested. Maybe we can take it up tomorrow. Thanks again for ALL your time. You hav ebeen helpful.

The little bare wire is broken... don't worry about that for now.

The points are currently closed... do they actually open?

Will pick it up tomorrow!

Thomas

I'll be at work tomorrow... we have a '68 Beetle there. I'll record some video and will post
it on my Youtube Channel when I get home.

Do the same test again:

- leave the condenser attached to coil neg, but disconnect the points from the condensor pin
- key on
- light should light-up
- if not, then the voltage is grounding out through the condenser

I'll do the same and will post my findings.

Once you / we find where the voltage is grounding out, you / we will find the cause of
the "no spark" issue.

Thomas

Good morning Thomas. I know it is still early on your side of the country. I will be jumping on this thing around noon here. Thanks again for your help. I was wondering why you take the time to help us flunkies like myself??? I know it takes alot of your time. I will run the test that you stated in your last post and let you know around noon.